BMI, factual triggers and taking responsibility

September 25, 2006

[brenjane]: hi jilly
[brenjane]: first time jilly welcome
[jilly]: how r u
[brenjane]: recovering
[brenjane]: i was sick for almost a wk
[brenjane]: i lost 6 pounds
[jilly]: is that a good thing
[brenjane]: i dont recommend anyone go wo eating
[brenjane]: hi def
[delfinodigrazia]: hi
[brenjane]: is it the first time for both of u
[delfinodigrazia]: my first time
[brenjane]: welcome
[delfinodigrazia]: thanks
[brenjane]: what is on ur minds tonite
[jilly]: i've been before
[delfinodigrazia]: is there a topic?
[brenjane]: any special topic on your minds
[brenjane]: not really
[brenjane]: gso maybe u can explain more of what we do in the chat room
[brenjane]: hi dragonfly
[gso]: hello, sorry i am late my 3 year old just missed out on making it to the bathroom,,,,,,
[dragonfly]: hello
[brenjane]: no prob
[jilly]: too cute
[gso]: anyway hello
[brenjane]: i miss those days gso
[gso]: brenjane you have a question?
[brenjane]: yea
[gso]: go ahead
[brenjane]: ive been having trouble eating
[brenjane]: i didnt eat for 5 days
[jilly]: ur so lucky
[brenjane]: and lost 6 pounds
[gso]: are you physically ill or unwell?
[brenjane]: the dr said bowel gas
[gso]: why do you think you didn't eat?
[brenjane]: i dont really know i know that when i eat i double over in pain after eating
[delfinodigrazia]: is this chat for ed support?
[brenjane]: yes
[gso]: so it sounds like you may be unwell
[brenjane]: pain
[gso]: when do you see your doctor?
[delfinodigrazia]: do you always use numbers in here?
[jilly]: is it a trigger for u
[gso]: hello delfin, what do you mean numbers? sorry
[brenjane]: i cant get an appointment
[delfinodigrazia]: i've just never been in a ed group where it was ok to use numbers
[gso]: brenjane are you going to see a dr?
[jilly]: it was ew for me 2
[gso]: what numbers are you referring to
[brenjane]: im afraid to when the pa said it was only gas
[jilly]: some people here have eds
[delfinodigrazia]: saying how much weight was lost
[jilly]: other people have other eating issues
[brenjane]: my own dr was away last wk
[gso]: some people have binge eating disorder
[brenjane]: and i saw the covering pa
[gso]: and are struggling with their weight
[jilly]: do u suffer from anorexia?
[delfinodigrazia]: me?
[jilly]: ya
[delfinodigrazia]: yes
[brenjane]: im too the point now where i am afraid to eat
[jilly]: me 2
[brenjane]: ive tolerated liquid
[jilly]: r u in recovery
[gso]: delfin what is important is to determine who is at a healthy weight and why....brenjane knows this
[brenjane]: my wt is now 147
[gso]: brenjane please see a doctor
[mimi]: hi everybody
[gso]: hello mimi
[dragonfly]: hi mimi
[delfinodigrazia]: i'm on my way jilly
[brenjane]: my kids seem to think its all in my head and my son refuses to take me to the er when its bad at night
[gso]: 'does anyone have a topic they would like to start with?
[gso]: delfino you are beginning treatment?
[delfinodigrazia]: no
[brenjane]: he is the only driver which means the squad the only option and then i would be stuck in the er
[delfinodigrazia]: i've been in treatment for awhile
[gso]: how did you hear about this website?
[jilly]: how's it going so far?
[delfinodigrazia]: i think i found it on the CRAED website maybe??
[delfinodigrazia]: i can't remember
[gso]: Oh ok
[delfinodigrazia]: i found it awhile ago
[brenjane]: gso im at my halfway pt on jenny craig
[brenjane]: lost 25
[brenjane]: need to learn how to eat on my own
[gso]: great job brenjane.....................re the numbers.......typically numbers are taboo in ed treatment
[brenjane]: sorry
[brenjane]: idont how to do figuring for eating on my own again
[gso]: but I take a different approach
[mimi]: bren, Im glad to hear of your loss over the weeks, it's given me hope
[gso]: I help people determine if they are at a healthy weight or not....sounds easy but it is a rather complicated question
[jilly]: tell me if i'm at a healthy weight gso
[brenjane]: im glad mimi
[gso]: and dangerous if someone incorrectly assumes they have a weight problem, when in actuality they do not
[brenjane]: im always here to give u support if u need it
[gso]: OK jilly go ahead
[mimi]: thanks
[delfinodigrazia]: you don' t think it triggers other people? Because not all people who are say, 5'2 should weigh the same thing
[jilly]: what do i tell u...weight and height?
[gso]: yes for starters...
[jilly]: 5'4....110
[gso]: how old are you jilly?
[jilly]: 25
[brenjane]: mimi the key to it for me was i felt like i wasnt on a diet
[gso]: OK there are up to three ways to determine if someone is at a healthy weight
[gso]: first let's look at the Body Mass Index which is a ratio of height to weight
[gso]: Body Mass Index or BMI is a helpful index because it provides you with a healthy weight range of 20-30 lbs, depending upon your height....lots of flexibility
[gso]: so jilly your BMI is 19
[gso]: typically, people live the longest if they have a BMI of 20-25......so jilly according to the BMI you MAY be a bit underweight
[gso]: if you were 116, that would bring you up to a BMI of 20
[gso]: 145 is the upper most limit of a healthy weight for someone 5ft 4inches
[jilly]: how else can u determine healthy weight
[gso]: well Body Fat Percentage is, for me, the most useful
[brenjane]: what is a bmi for 4 ft 11 147
[brenjane]: or where i should be
[gso]: brenjane, you do need to slowly lose weight in order to increase your longevity
[jilly]: whats the lowest healthy weight
[gso]: no less than 130 or so I would say
[gso]: for what height jilly?
[jilly]: 54
[gso]: 116 jilly
[jilly]: interesting.....
[gso]: the BMI is nice because it is based on scientific studies re longevity....in fact longitudinal studies which have the highest generalizability (a scientific-statisitical term)
[gso]: any questions?
[jilly]: weight is always a bad way to measure
[jilly]: delf...is this killing u?
[gso]: body fat is a fine indicator of health because it measures how much of your weight is fat versus muscle
[delfinodigrazia]: absolutely. and i'm asking myself why i'm still sitting here.
[brenjane]: i was wondering what i should do now that i am going from pkg dinners to actual eating
[brenjane]: im afraid of screwing up
[gso]: brenjane I am not familiar enough with the program to be helpful here sorry
[gso]: delfino what comments do you have right now? I'm interested to hear your thoughts
[mimi]: hi llb
[brenjane]: hi llb
[brenjane]: how are u this wk
[delfinodigrazia]: it's hard to comment here because you can't hear my tone and i don't want to come off the wrong way
[llb]: hey
[llb]: i'm fine thanks bren
[gso]: it is OK delfino I understand
[brenjane]: dont worry about what u sound like delfino
[mimi]: del is there any way you feel we can help you?
[brenjane]: thats what this chat is for to help ea other
[brenjane]: tone or not u are not judged
[delfinodigrazia]: it's just this is all new to me. i know in the "real" world things like this won't be censored. i guess that is why i forced myself to stay
[gso]: del ed's are majorly deceptive....you feel fat.....but it is a lie, like it is brainwashing you
[brenjane]: how was ur wk llb
[gso]: that is why BMI can be helpful....it can be the "voice of reason" when your feelings seem to take over your behavior
[gso]: that is when ed's become deadly....when you stop thinking about the facts....when you let the feelings take over
[delfinodigrazia]: but, you see, i would like to think that i am on my way to recovery my "ed" head hears what someone who is taller than me weighs and cannot help but compare what i weigh and then convince myself that i am overweight.
[llb]: it was ok bren :-)
[brenjane]: glad to hear that llb
[gso]: del that is where facts about the BMI are critical to you beating this.....if you don't think about numbers and the facts it can get all muddled
[brenjane]: any thing on ur mind llb
[gso]: forgetting the facts gives you room to manipulate any number you have in your head
[delfinodigrazia]: that's true
[llb]: just "listening"
[brenjane]: ok
[brenjane]: i dont want u to think that ur werent being ignored
[llb]: ;-0
[gso]: del these are tough issues.....but very real....the feelings are real and the statistics are undeniable
[llb]: ;-)
[gso]: people with a BMI of below 20 are in very real danger......no matter how "fat" they feel
[delfinodigrazia]: for real?
[gso]: so for me numbers are not taboo:-)
[gso]: the healthiest people (the people who live the longest) have BMI's between 20 and 25
[gso]: that is a very real fact
[delfinodigrazia]: but don't you think people get triggered by hearing other people's weights?
[gso]: it depends on how they manipulate the discussion in their head
[gso]: and that is all part of the illness
[delfinodigrazia]: i guess it would depend on how sick they are
[mimi]: hey dimples, glad youre here
[dimples]: thanks mimi
[brenjane]: hi dimples
[gso]: I try to help my pt's stick to the facts
[mimi]: del, would it trigger you if you heard how overweight I am as a binge eater?
[delfinodigrazia]: so really, if they weren't strong enough, it would only serve to make them sicker (not trying to argue)
[delfinodigrazia]: no....you're OK mimi
[gso]: you could say that about any intervention right?
[dimples]: hi bren
[gso]: but if they really want to try to recover they will entertain the true facts
[jilly]: did i trigger you?
[jilly]: i'm sorry
[jilly]: that was my need
[llb]: hey dimples ;-)
[jilly]: to find out bmi
[dimples]: hey llb
[jilly]: i can understand how that was stupid of me to have done
[delfinodigrazia]: but, i think eating disorders are different than other addictions in that they are somehow glamorous in a sick sort of way to some
[jilly]: i twist it in my head too when i hear people talk about it
[delfinodigrazia]: jilly you're fine.......thanks though
[gso]: why did that trigger you del?
[gso]: how?
[delfinodigrazia]: what trigger me?
[jilly]: talking about weight
[delfinodigrazia]: no...i said you were fine
[delfinodigrazia]: i'm not blaming you
[mimi]: dimples, how was your week?
[gso]: jilly did the talk about BMI help you in any way?
[dimples]: its been rough mimi - how are you
[mimi]: so so, but I thought of you this week
[jilly]: i guess....i wish it scared me to be a little underweight
[dimples]: thank you
[gso]: does it scare you jilly?
[gso]: to know that having a BMI of 19 is more dangerous than having a BMI of 28
[mimi]: gso, why is it more dangerous?
[jilly]: i feel bad for del...now she left
[jilly]: i understand that because when i used to see girls who were skinnier than me..it was a trigger for me too
[jilly]: i feel a little guilty right now
[gso]: because being a little bit overweight poses no health risk for most people.....but being underweight stresses the body immensely
[mimi]: I didnt know that
[gso]: jilly please understand that you were asking for information in order to help yourself think more clearly......a very important piece of recovery.....if that triggers someone it is their responsibility to figure out why...not yours to tip toe around their triggers
[gso]: mimi that fact is blatantly ignored by the media......which is a disgrace and irresponsible
[jilly]: your right.
[gso]: jilly do you understand?
[gso]: if you go through recovery, especially groups, and question yourself when you get your needs met, you undermine your own treatment
[jilly]: i understand. her triggers are not related to be
[jilly]: me
[mimi]: dimples was your week a little better than last week?
[dimples]: no mimi - no better just different
[jilly]: i wish my bmi was 17
[gso]: think of it this way.......how productive is it for you to say "that is a trigger for me" versus "hummm I wonder why that triggers me..." one is blaming....the other shows a desire to get better
[mimi]: hopefully this coming week will be different again and better
[jilly]: interesting when things get reframed how much more logical they become!
[gso]: don't know what to say jilly............. dimples how are you?
[dimples]: im ready for it to start getting better
[mimi]: that's good news
[gso]: any changes you'd like to report?
[gso]: dimples?
[dimples]: its really hard to talk about it right now
[gso]: I think we were all worried about you last week
[gso]: that is OK...we are just glad you are alright and came back
[dimples]: thanks everyone -
[gso]: you deserve it!! you all deserve to give yourself a chance
[jilly]: what happened?
[jilly]: or should we nopt revisit it
[gso]: good question jilly
[jilly]: i just did my nails and so all the letters i'm typing r coming out wrong
[jilly]: sorry!
[jilly]: that's ok dimples...it sounds like it's hard to talk about
[dimples]: it is jilly - im just trying my best to hold on
[dimples]: and be strong
[gso]: dimples are you trying to keep yourself safe?
[dimples]: yes
[gso]: that is great
[gso]: I have to ask a question of you all.....if I had to charge a small fee in order to do the chats and be able to read them.....what monthly fee could you afford? give an amount that is no more than $20 a month or so
[gso]: I want to generate enough funds to just keep the site going
[gso]: not want.....need to
[mimi]: can we tell you next week? or do you need to know now?
[gso]: you can tell me next week.......
[gso]: dimples do you want to say anything about yourself?
[jilly]: will we need to oay by month or chat
[gso]: by the month.......
[jilly]: k....where can i buy ur book by the way
[gso]: I am thinking in the $5 to $20 range per month
[dimples]: just send good thoughts my way this week would be very much appreciated
[mimi]: dimples, you've got them from me
[gso]: jilly on the website or send me a check to 5 Pine st......glens falls new york 12801
[jilly]: i can do that 4 u dimples!
[jilly]: i'm already starting!
[jilly]: k...thanks gso
[dimples]: you dont know how much that means right now
[gso]: dimples do you know the serenity prayer?
[dimples]: no i dont
[gso]: please search for it....I will do my "Serenity Prayer" hourly one day this week for everyone in the chat tonight.....even del
[gso]: it is probably on the net somewhere
[jilly]: ur so sweet
[dimples]: thank you for that!
[jilly]: it so nice to come here to such warmth!
[mimi]: thanks gso
[gso]: well good night all.///////you are all so welcome have a good week"-)
[gso]: :-)
[llb]: good night
[mimi]: good night everyone, see you next week
[dimples]: night everyone